Epocdigest V1 # 360

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Epoc Digest Fri, 10 Oct 2003 Volume 01 : Number 360

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Sent to: 799 subscribers

In today's Epoc Digest 16 messages:

==============================

- Re: Psion now freeze

- Re: WhyFi?

- Rolf's Digest (#359) ;)

- Re: Revo again

- Symbian netBook pro, Microsoft, REVO batteries, Netpad keyboard,

- Re: phone info needed Nokia 6610 # 359 (486)

- Re: Revo battery problems

- New Forum???

- mBook email problem

- Scotalnd

- Re: Microsoft to Rolf B.

- Re: Microsoft - to Rolf

- The future/where does your Psion fall short?/moaning again

- Re: Microsoft

- Re: Microsoft # 355

- RE: Re: netBook Pro Symbian...

*++++++++++&

Date: 9 Oct 2003 03:07:04 -0500

From: Jaan Sass

Subject: Re: Psion now freeze

It's funny that has not happened to me but sometimes when I switch between opera and the e-mail program it will freeze and then have to do a soft reset. I dont know what causes it but have found no other solution except to do soft reset.

> Sergio wrote:

> Hi boy! I have a serious new problem with my Psions,

> when I connect to internet! The connecttion go OK, but

> after a few seconds or minutes my Psion freezes-up.

> Often the only solution is a soft reset other a

> Crtl+Shift+Fn+K wake-up my Psion! Psion go right only if

> the connection go down! Do you know some solution

> >>><<<

> Hello,

> For the second time I'm writing about this: this is

> precisely the problem with my S7 - at least once a

> internet session I have to turn off the machine (usually

> only way to unstick Web or Opera these days, Control U

> works maybe

> 10% of time ) or do Kill Function (works for Email

> occasionally, but while downloading mail the server

> disconnects and if Control U doesn't work, I have to

> turn off the machine. I no longer keep email open while

> using either browser, leaving email open during a

> browser freeze results in email not knowing whether it's

> connected or not. Regardless of care taken, every day

> eventually the machine simply freezes and nothing works

> except a soft reset.

> I'm re-installing Opera at least once a day as well.

> This is my stand-alone computer, I connect to the

> internet using a landline and various Gold Card modems.

> I realize this may sound terribly boring to those of

> you using advanced mobile connections with all the bells

> and whistles or maybe PCs, but there is at least one of

> us still in the Stone Age who would appreciate being

> included in the equation since we may have some small

> motivation to take another look at some theories and

> perhaps eliminate some others. I realize statistically

> one landline user with the same problem wouldn't matter

> in a scientific study but we're among friends here;

> humor me please - this is truly annoying for one who has

> no other computer to fall back on (and proud of it,

> datgummit ;^). Another irritation: all documents

> saved in Opera default to Web after the soft reset - is

> there a solution to this? Doesn't matter whether I

> installed opera to C or D.

> Also, again if I may rephrase my earlier request; some

> time ago, there was mention of ISPs adopting new?

> different? SMTP protocol and of software that allowed

> Email to conform - might the possibility of some of our

> ISP's use of this protocol have some relevance?

> Best,

> renee in Tucson, AZ

Bye bye

*++++++++++&

Date: 9 Oct 2003 03:07:40 -0500

From: Jaan Sass

Subject: Re: WhyFi?

I could think of a lot of good reasons the biggest I personally perfer my Psion over laptops and Desktop computers. The Psion is more rugged and and does what I need it to do and more. Laptops break easy and have a lot of stuff I am not interested in. y the way I use dial up with my psion 7. I recently download AOL instant messanger that works with the Psion 7 I found it on the psion top 50 software site. It is a Java program so you need to have the mobile Java installed. The program works great.

> Why use WiFi with a Psion in a situation where you could

> use a PC/laptop/Mac? Even if you can get a fast

> connection speed, you're still using Web or Opera on a

> much smaller screen.

> Richard

Bye bye

*++++++++++&

Date: 9 Oct 2003 09:21:48 -0500

From: "Simon Wolf"

Subject: Rolf's Digest (#359) ;)

It's always a nice treat when a 'Rolf Digest' arrives since it allows me to start the day with a coffee and a good read of interesting and generally well-informed, if sometimes slightly controversial, views. Digest number 359 was no exception but there are a couple of comments and views that I would like to comment on ...

Regarding Microsoft's anti-competitor issue and the idea that it has sabotaged and hindered the work of competing companies I want to restrict my comments only to PDA synchronisation issues. My question is why has Palm's Hotsync software always, s far as I know, been a very robust and reliable application with excellent synchronisation abilities? In fact Hotsync is seen as being more robust and more effective than Microsoft's ActiveSync although I have no idea how well or badly the latest v rsion performs. Could it be that Psion were perhaps a little over-ambitious in trying to integrate PsiWin with Windows and would have been better off having a system more similar to the SIBO PsiWin software? Would it also have been a good idea if Psion had made their PIM applications more 'synchronisable' since, as far as I know, records in the PIM applications do not contain unique IDs and therefore synchronisation relies on comparing like text with like text rather than mapping record IDs whi h is a more stable and reliable approach? Perhaps Microsoft are not totally to blame for PsiWin's problems and maybe the finger of blame should be pointed at Psion. Having said that, however, it is not just Psion who have problems with serial cable onnections and other software such as Nokia's phone synchronisation software (for the 6310i at least) completely blocks its serial port (I eventually had to uninstall the application) in an attempt to maintain some stability.

As a recent convert to Apples from Windows (despite being a Windows application developer by trade) I am obliged to comment on a couple of points that were made. ;) The problems in Windows are not just restricted to stability (whether that be cau ed by hardware configurations or not) and in my opinion the security issues are far more important and more destructive to Microsoft's reputation. The sheer number of security updates released by Microsoft demonstrates that their operating systems a e inherently insecure and the volume of viruses are also testament to this. However, rather than go on about this myself I would rather urge people to have a look at a very good article that The Register posted about this:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/56/33226.html. The majority of the article focuses on Windows versus Linux but since Mac OS X is essentially a Unix system I think that it is relevant.

Regarding Apple's styling, I totally disagree that Apple's designs are off-putting but then again, as an Apple owner I am likely to be biased. However, comparing my beige PC box at home to an iMac (which I do not have) I know which I would prefer for s ze and general aesthetics. In addition, regarding the upgradability of Apple machines, one of the points of Macs is that you do not buy the machine and then spend your time and money upgrading it yourself. As far as I can tell people tend to b y a Mac and use it for years and years since the demands of most (non-gaming) software means that a machine that is three or four years old is not obsolete. I suppose that Macs are a bit like Psions in that the operating system and the applications end to be less demanding than their Windows cousins and therefore, like a Psion compared to a Pocket PC, a low spec Mac is actually comparable to a higher spec PC in terms of usefulness. I also do not think that people buy Windows PC over Macs becau e they can upgrade their machines themselves but rather because most PCs in the world run Windows and therefore people think that they have to do so too so as to be compatible.

Finally, I think that Rolf might have misinterpreted both Mac users and Apple's advertising campaign. The Mac users that I have been in touch with, either in person or via electronic means, tend to feel that Windows users look down on them as stu id eccentrics who like to use a second-rate option to Windows PCs. You may have encountered some snobbishness but I personally have not and I have actually found Mac users to be a lot like Psion users in that they are generally friendly and helpful nd have a great community spirit. As for the 'Think Different' campaign, I do not think that I will be able to convince you otherwise but I see it as saying that there is an alternative to Windows and intelligent people use it rather than just compu er illiterate idiots who need a Fisher Price-type machine. Part of the appeal of Macs is that you don't have to be brilliant to use them since they are intuitive and straightforward (as opposed to relying on a less than perfect Registry and DLLs, OC s and other assorted files to be scattered liberally around your hard disc).

Apple certainly are not perfect and I do not think that anyone with a balanced view would claim otherwise but their machines are a good alternative to PCs, their operating system suits some people more than Windows does (and would suit someone like my ather who always seems to catch every virus that he can). I don't think that they are the Bang & Olufsen of computers but I'll accept your compliment with good grace. ;)

Simon Wolf

*++++++++++&

Date: 9 Oct 2003 09:49:50 -0500

From: Ian Chapple

Subject: Re: Revo again

Dear Rolf,

>> There you go again. I'm very sorry, Ian, but this shows that you're all too ready to jump to conclusions without giving *any* thought to what's being proposed. It's now Mike's idea, that the characteristics of NiMH batteries are the source, yo 're jumping on. Without asking any questions you treat his proposal as true and use this 'truth' to build a rather

nasty picture of Psion's developers.

...

The reputation of a person doesn't only depend on what (s)he says and does but also on what's being said about him/her. People's reputations have

been severely damaged by gossip and innuendo that lacked any basis in fact.

You're doing exactly the same for the Revo at this moment. What you do is equivalent to those who talk about the moral depravity of certain TV programs without having watched them. You don't own a Revo, but have heard others talk about something that's called 'The Revo battery problem'. Without having a clue about what the problem really is, you pick up anything put forward that fits the picture you've built up in your own

mind : Flawed device. Now, if there's something that's "poor, and can't be relied on", to use your own words, it's this. <<

Why is it that you think nobody is capable of rational thought apart from yourself? As a qualified engineer, and now an examiner at the European Patent Office, I am perfectly capable of assessing what I read, nd drawing my own conclusions. Maybe Psion did make the wrong choice of battery, maybe they didn't. Maybe the Revo's charging circuit works properly, maybe it doesn't. The point is, there are more problems with the Revo with regards to battery charging/ba tery life than with any other Psion, and that is cause for concern, particularly for those people who, through no fault of their own, find themselves with a Revo which they

can't rely on.

As an apple iPod owner, I am extremely enthousiastic about it, and have nothing but praise for what it is and what it can do. However, it is clear from the postings on the iPod forum that people have serious c mplaints about the battery performance and the quality of the supplied software. Now, I am not as narrow-minded or conceited as you, so I am open to the possibility that, despite my own happy experience as an iPod owner, there are many owners who are less than satisfied with what they have purchased.

Presumably, you feel that no-one is qualified to make any comment on anything, unless they have experienced it for themselves. That's total rubbish. People have to make objective decisions on all sorts of thin s, every day, based on what they know, be it from personal experience or from what they have heard. To suggest otherwise is ridiculous.

Regards, Ian Chapple.

*++++++++++&

Date: 9 Oct 2003 13:46:36 -0500

From: Itamar Engelsman

Subject: Symbian netBook pro, Microsoft, REVO batteries, Netpad keyboard,

Answer to: Gianluca Gallino

Re.: Symbian netBook pro - Well, I wish your group and you success, however I personally am very sceptical about the outcome. I don't think the public at large cares much whether a netBook Pro works with WindowsCE or Symbian 7 (or 5) and without tens o thousands if not hundreds of thousands of signatures you don't stand a chance to convince anyone at Psion. Even if the current version 7 works with most of the hardware, it will still need to be adapted to fully work with it and that will cost far more i development, software writing, testing, etc. than they would ever make on selling a few thousand pieces. Besides, who would be interested in such a machine at the current price level of the nB Pro ? You can get "all singing all dancing" machines fo about half that price I believe. Personally, I think it was great using the Psion's when they were available and for as long as my current ones will continue to work, but life moves on and so do computers and PDA's too. I also don't think there is a "sou d business case" for such a machine. For most businesses the dcompatibillity between Windows and WindowsCE is a distinct advantage and without a rewritten Psiwin giving such a compatibillity with Symbian OS the case is very weak. I think Rolf's reservatio s are also well noted. But again, I wish you success.

Answer to: Rolf Brunsting

Re. Microsoft - Working in that field your knowledge is undoubtedly larger than mine. I understand what you are saying re. OS <-> software. While in specific cases Microsoft might have gone beyond the law, I still think that other Companies try s milar things. Buying a Nikon camera I have to buy a Nikon flash to get full compatibillity as Nikon will not give away their specifics for others to copy (Metz still did not succeed with a flash for the Nikon D100). Buying a BMW car meant I get a sound sy tem built in that cannot be changed. I am sure most car makers will do their best to stop third parties from making their spare parts. These examples might not fit exactly the Microsoft situation, but are the same idea. In the end, who decides what is eth cal or not ? What is ethical for you might be non-ethical for me and vice versa. The Law can be enforced or decided by judges, ehtics not that easily.

Re. REVO batteries - Sorry, I don't remember the message anymore, my remark was in reaction to another message.

>> "What you're saying is that a number of Series 5mx's were pre-destined

>> to suffer from screen cable failure. "

No, what I am saying is that it is a fact that some 5MX users have suffered a broken screen cable. If I would be a potential buyer of a 5MX and look at user reports to find that some people had that problem, it would make me take that into consideratio . The same applies for the REVO battery problem.

Re. Netpad keyboard - Please keep us updated if/when you try it out. It could make a difference in many subscribers decision process.

Best regards,

Itamar Engelsman

London, UK

*++++++++++&

Date: 9 Oct 2003 14:18:42 -0500

From: Mark Deppe

Subject: Re: phone info needed Nokia 6610 # 359 (486)

Susan Katz Hoffman Wrote : <<<I know own a Nokia 6610, and I notice that it has an infrared capability and a calendar feature. Can I infrared my 5mx contacts and calendar info to my phone?>>>

Yes you can, Calander eventys one at a time, just press the softkey on left of screen "infrared send". The phone also works well with Phoneman from zenobyte which will allow you to manage the extended phonebook.

Also GPRS and GSM email and web work well with this phone

Kind regards

Mark

---------------------------------

Want to chat instantly with your online friends?¤Get the FREE Yahoo!Messenger

*++++++++++&

Date: 9 Oct 2003 14:42:50 -0500

From: Mike Dyer

Subject: Re: Revo battery problems

Reply to Rolf Brunsting

Re: Revo battery problems

Hi Rolf,

NiMh batteries alas still suffer from 'memory effect' like the old NiCd batteries. If you don't deplete them a reasonable amount you will not get a true full rec arge.

The problem with charging using the docking cradle is that you often get an intermittant connection, sometimes unfairly blamed on PsiWin but usually purely mechanical, the typical Revo owner sometimes has to press the unit just below the screen to make an effective connection.

So what? you might say. Well everytime the charging cycle is interuppted by a poor connection on the cradle, your poor old batteries will be fast charged again instead of trickle charged. Plug the thing directly into the power supply go to bed and let the charging system and its thermal sensor do its work.

I have had two trouble free years now with my Revo+, it was the best Psion since the series 3. A laptop you can easily fit in a pocket. The batteries still last more than a working day of laptop style use, or nearly two weeks when ju t used as a pda.

To all on the Digest, I'm not pretending to be an expert in these matters, I'm just relating to you my personal experiences.

Regards,

Mike Dyer.

*++++++++++&

Date: 9 Oct 2003 17:16:00 -0500

From: Jim Watson-Gove

Subject: New Forum???

<< I think we EPOC users have no other choice but to widen our horizon and look at other machines as well. The world is developing and new machines will come out. ISP's will change their systems, Wifi and Bluetooth are here, in the end we will fi d ourselves disconnected from the world with our EPOC systems. Sad, indeed. Maybe in the future we will have to create a new digest to stay in contact with each other.>>

Itamar,

It's like evolution vs revolution. I see our options evolving and our responses likewise. Many of us are exploring other devises and slowly moving onto new platforms. As long as my Psions are working and (the

catch) repairable at an affordable price (repairs have significantly increased in cost over the last two years), I will continue to use them for some functions. For most others I am moving onto Palm OS (Treo + Dana).

The digest is primarily Psion today with tolerance shown to posting regard other platforms. I see it eventually supporting Psion (Symbian? EPOC?), Pocket PC, and Palm, because we will have changed - same people, different distribution of machines

Just my opinion - don't shut down the digest just yet (796 and still growing).

jim - port townsend, washington

*++++++++++&

Date: 9 Oct 2003 17:55:14 -0500

From: Tony Lough

Subject: mBook email problem

Am having problems with newly acquired mBook. I have configured the

Internet and Email applications in Control Panel as per the instructions on

Mike McConnell's website and my Compuserve POP mail works fine on a PC.

However the moment I hit the "open mail-box" icon up pops the message

"Problem connecting to remote mailbox ........ Could not find specified

email server...."

I'm not sure if it is relevant but if I try to open a web page with Opera

the immediate response is "Could not find PROXY server"

It has been suggested that the Commsdb.dat that I copied from my 5mx

differs from the netBook version

Does anyone have any thoughts on this problem and could someone send me a

copy of their netBook commsdb.file?

Many thanks

Tony Lough

Southport

*++++++++++&

Date: 9 Oct 2003 19:25:59 -0500

From: Timothy H.D. Williams

Subject: Scotalnd

On Wednesday, October 8, 2003, at 11:07 PM, Rolf wrote:

> Kind Regards,

> Rolf Brunsting - St. Andrews - Scotland

> Kind Regards,

> Rolf Brunsting - Leadburn - Scotland

> Kind Regards,

> Rolf Brunsting - Arbroath - Scotland

> Kind Regards,

> Rolf Brunsting - Ceres - Scotland

> Kind Regards,

> Rolf Brunsting - Aberdeen - Scotland

Hey, Rolf, you got through St Andrews fast. It took me five years and I had to sit exams at the end.

Best

*++++++++++&

Date: 9 Oct 2003 19:33:11 -0500

From: Edgar Brazda MD, PhD

Subject: Re: Microsoft to Rolf B.

> It's much easier to create a stable

> operating system when you're in full control of the hardware it's > running on. The vast majority of differences in interpretation

> between hardware and software developers are found in-house and > solved in-house before release.

I am sorry to say but I had the same expectations when in the '80s we were able to use only cheap IBM clones here - in Eastern Europe. You can imagine my feeling when - in the middle of '90s - I met the first real IBM, Compaq, etc, "big name" desktop a d laptop machines. And to my disappointment they were and are not more stable either. So, where are those stable machines which comply all hardware specs and as a benefit can avoid daily crashes?

Ususal disclaimer: no statistical sampling and data processing were performed. It is only my personal experience.

Edgar, Budapest

*++++++++++&

Date: 9 Oct 2003 20:05:13 -0500

From: Edgar Brazda MD, PhD

Subject: Re: Microsoft - to Rolf

> Somebody with a limited budget can buy a 'simple' PC and upgrade it > with the desired bells and whistles in a step by step fashion.

It could be seen pro-PC leaflets in the '80s, but I expected a more objective approach from you, Rolf. You know well, that this dream has never come true. Not being you, I can not put together an elaborate explanation, but pls. remember the incompatibl RAMs, the changing ports e.g. for a mouse (serial, PS, USB), and bus system, and all the card (ISA, VESA, ...) you have to discard when you upgrade your motherboard, oh, yes, and the new motherboards do not fit in the old house, so you have to change it oo, and so on, and so on.

The last time I could do a real add-on was when I bought a 8037 math co-processor - about 10 years ago.

Pls, understand, I -as everyone- wish to do a cheap UPGRADE but it simply does not work (not considering a few simple changes during a considerably short period of time after buying the PC), which is sad, but on the other hand, for it is due to the hig speed of development in the hardware field, it is quite acceptable.

Edgar, Budapest

*++++++++++&

Date: 9 Oct 2003 20:56:15 -0500

From: Kevin Thorne

Subject: The future/where does your Psion fall short?/moaning again

Itamar Engelsman wrote:

<Sad, indeed. Maybe in the future we will have to create a new digest to stay in contact with each other.>

I've often wondered on the future course of the Digest. It's inevitable that more and more subscribers will be looking at alternative machines as our beloved Psions die of old age, get broken/lost or eventually become too antiquated compared with the new generation of PDAs. The "other brand PDA" discussion content has risen appreciably over time, inevitably because of the aforementioned reasons and also, quite expectedly, because of increasingly resolved problems on our mature EPOC platform. nbsp; I do hope, whatever future route the Digest takes, we will all stay in contact on what must be one of the friendliest forums around.

Just to get a new discussion thread going for subscribers, here's a question: Where or how does your Psion fall short in terms of usefulness or ability against the latest PDAs? To start the ball rolling, here's my t'pennyworth:

My main worry is Web. I use my S7 extensively for surfing (I don't own a PC) and I am finding more and more sites complain I'm not using a minimum version of Internet Explorer. I'm not a great fan of Opera's graphical interface but maybe us ng it will be the only realistic way of surfing on my S7 in a few year's time. Web does support plug-ins but it now looks very unlikely that anyone will bother writing these to make it more compatible with many sites.

My main moan is an old chestnut of mine - the ridiculously limited amount of RAM on my 9210. It really does have the potential to become a relacement to my beloved 5mx but it gets my goat to see all these Pocket PCs and Palms shipping now with 64 b (and even 128Mb I believe) of the stuff whilst I am trying to manage on less than 4Mb of system RAM, running a great O/S that could easily cope with running a dozen or more open files at once IF ONLY there was enough system RAM. Sure, I know I'm c mparing a hybrid device with dedicated PDAs and I'm probably classed as an ER6 power user but still.... Anyway, thanks for listening, I feel better now I've had my rant :-)

Regards

Kevin Thorne

*++++++++++&

Date: 9 Oct 2003 21:04:40 -0500

From: Ajai Khattri

Subject: Re: Microsoft

On 8 Oct 2003 21:21:01 -0500, Rolf Brunsting wrote:

>Is it strange then that Microsoft has more difficulties in supplying an

>operating system that's consistently stable? I don't think so.

I think up to a certain point this is true - however there are some fundamental

flaws in the architecture that could have been fixed early on... right now Im having

to deal with various virii and/or worms that exploit stupid features of OutLook and

IE.

>When Apple's MacOS had to run on, and work with, hardware that's for 99.99%

>not developed by Apple it would have the same problems.

Again, yes and no. MacOS X for example, is based largely on FreeBSD. FreeBSD is very portable (its cousin, NetBSD runs on something like 40

platforms!) and

runs on the same hardware as Windoze (Ive no doubt Apple has MacOS X running on Intel hardware internally). FreeBSD is also many many times more stable and secure than Windoze. (I work for an ISP, most of our servers are FreeBSD or Linux boxes, some of which are only ever rebooted to install a new kernel).

Thus I would expect MacOS X to run very well on Intel hardware if they ever chose to abandon the PPC chips. The only reason we haven't seen MacOS X on Intel is to protect Apple's hardware business, not because its isn't possible.

>EPOC doesn't have to do that and has a smaller memory footprint as a result.

I dont think this has anything to do with it. When writing software that

is portable

across various platforms, its true that there will be a lot of code with lots branches

to handle the various hardware dependencies. But ultimately, when you

build and

deploy, the differences in sizes of binaries and thus ROM footprints is going to be

pretty close for most platforms. NetBSD has only a small chunk of code

that depends

on the hardware, the rest is abstracted above it and runs across all platforms.

>Apple's computers also have a rather limited potential for expansion and modification.

Depends on the model of course. An iMac is only limited because of its

form-factor and not

for any technical reason. All Macs use PCI, USB and Firewire, all of

which are pretty

mainstream in the PC world.

Aj.

Systems Administrator / Developer

*++++++++++&

Date: 9 Oct 2003 23:48:55 -0500

From: Alan Morris

Subject: Re: Microsoft # 355

vlad a wrote:-

<< If I remember right, it went like this: MS licenced it from Apple up to Mac OS version 2 or 1,5. Then they went on developing it along the same lines. When Apple's Steve Jobs threatened to sue or sued his college-chummy, MS threatened in excha ge to stop developing applications for the Mac. Besides, the Apple ideas were already sort of public domain - folder symbols, windows... all the great things... The dispute remained unsolved and evolved toward that failed Apple-MS allliance some years aft r that. So it is even worse: sounded like blackmail... >>

And before that Apple pinched the research done by Xerox. Xerox didn't use it, possibly because it did not improve office efficiency.

Alan R Morris, G4ENS.

Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk, UK.

Using a Psion 7 & Nokia 6210e.

*++++++++++&

Date: 10 Oct 2003 10:16:46 -0500

From: David Steer \(Plus\)

Subject: RE: Re: netBook Pro Symbian...

Rolf,

You are right, it is continuity that I am after, and I suspect a great many other users as well. One example of this is the TomTom City Maps, it will run on the Series 7 and the Nokia (OS6) but not OS7. In real terms, if TomTom brought out version for OS 7 that adds £50 to the price tag for an OS7 Netbook Pro. I have quite a number of such applications. Currently I live without USB and Bluetooth and for what I use my Series 7 for neither would be high priority, now 802.11b/g th t would great (hang-on OS 5 build 158 does that!). I will either buy an original NetBook or a Netbook Pro, but I would only get the Pro if I can maintain my current software base. I'm interested in hardware that can continue to run all my current ap lications not in a completely new software base. Other small points, we would loose the Data App, all files would have to be converted through PsiWin and then back out to the OS7 Netbook Pro.

Believe it or not, someone somewhere wrote that they though that the Current Psions were stone age compared to the current offerings!! That is the same sort of person that wouldn't have a Ferrari because it doesn't have a stereo!